Dealing with the cold

[fatbikephil]

Been following Steve Bates' winter HT attempt and it looks like he is up against it....
It hit -9 on my ride this evening. I've got my clothing pretty much sorted for such temps, striking a balance between keeping warm but not so warm you sweat, which then freezes.... It's not often it goes down as low as this round here but I'm quite pleased I was in reasonable comfort, apart from my toes.

I had my Lake winter boots on (rated to -10!) a pair of wool mix ski socks over thin sealskinz socks. I also had gaiters on. I also have a pair of Columbia bugaboots which are size 12, have space for two pairs of thick socks and themselves are allegedly good down to -20. When I wore these on the Rovaniemi 150 it was -5 and I got very cold feet. On road I use Northwave arctic goretex boots with Planet X neoprene overshoes. These are fine down to about -1 or -2 for a couple of hours. I like them alot to point where I'm in the process of buying another pair to replace mine which are falling apart (cheers Andy!).

So am I just screwed in terms of keeping feet warm or am I missing something? I've tried various thicknesses of socks, made sure my feet aren't pinched and stay dry. Any tips appreciated plus share your cold weather riding gear wisdom.

[Al]

I’ve got a very early morning commute over some decent hills with about 1000m height gain, the last week has been interesting!

Anything with cleats are your enemy- they just act like heat sinks. I use the same northwave boots, upsized one size than normal.
The best solution I’ve managed is making an innersole using aerogel insert over the clear area. They use it in space suits and it’s thin and about as non-conductive as you can get.
Beyond that I’d say it’s got to be flats with an insulated boot.

Don’t underestimate keeping the legs warm so the blood on it’s way to your feet isn’t getting cooled. I cut the toes and cuff off an old pair of hiking socks that we’re headed for the bin - they make a good lower leg warmer under the bib tights. Same goes for wrists.

[sean_iow]

Having chatted about this with my riding companions over the weekend I'm going to try flats to see if that's the answer. Would have been ideal at the weekend as we spent quite a bit of time walking when exploring the quarry.

Warm legs is vital, I've worn my waterproof trousers in the dry in spring when it's not raining but I've only got knee warmers on, especially at night, keeps the cold air off the exposed bit between the knee warner and my socks.

[whitestone]

I've been playing around with various clothing setups over the past few days in an attempt to find what works best for me at different levels of effort. It's helped that the weather has been pretty consistent temp wise during that time. Have got my body and hands sorted, at least for at or just below 0C but my feet need a little work.

I've been on the fat bike using flats. At first they were DMR plastic/composites but the NDS pedal failed on Saturday so I fitted my Hope flats (aluminium). Boots have been a decent hiking boot. My feet have never "felt" warm but when getting home and taking boots and socks off they are definitely warm to the touch. I think that it's the socks holding some dampness and it's that damp that I'm feeling rather than my feet actually being cold. I need to try a different set of socks to confirm.

I'd agree with the comments about keeping legs warm to ensure that the blood doesn't cool on its way to your feet. 45nrth used to do insulated gaiters but they no longer list them, presumably they didn't sell well. Maybe try some non-insulated gaiters to see if they help.

Edit: I should say that the rides varied in time from 1 hour up to 6 hours, no real difference in how my feet felt.

[redefined_cycles]

Phil... Sounds like you have a terribly cold feet problem. I countered the cleats one winter by using the ti/alloy Crank Bros ones. They worked well to not suck the heat out from the feet like Shimano do. But other than that they were pretty much, rubbish...

I've gone back to flatties for the winter (have just bought these for this winter due to em being cheap but not expecting too much good off em https://www.wiggle.co.uk/adidas-terrex- ... king-shoes ) as thats the only thing that really helped over the years.

Trying to fight the heat sink is just another few degrees that you're inevitably gonna lose from your feet no matter how good a insulation setup you've got. The Pedags (woolen German engineered insoles with some Nasa type stuff as a lining) worked well for the road ride to London in -2 and -4 but that was cos I'd managed to keep heat in elsewhere.

I'm basically somehow trying to covince you to go for flatties (proper winter boots with an open toe box) and plastic type pedals. V8 in alloy flavour is reducing the advantage of the system. Especailly when there are so many highly rated nylon pedals out there now. Add some decent quality insoles (if you wish to try the Pedags I can post em out to ya and you can keep if liked - they're not '0 drop' enough as I've found flat shoes to be helping with my back (pain).

[redefined_cycles]

Oh... and some of them thickest version of the Darn Tough family will also help the foot-warmth system (as would covering up the rest of the body appropriately). Don't forget the outdoor/walker saying of, "feet cold, put on a hat"

[ton]

i have a fused right ankle, it does not bend, it does not generate any heat from natural movement at all. so i have to insulate it.
in the past i have owned every kind of boot to help me, and until last winter they have all failed. the list is a expensive one.
shimano mt90, shimano mw7, 45NRTH wolvehammers, and i was the person who put the Columbia fairbanks book out there to try, which were the bast of the list.
last winter i bought a pair of these Keen Targhee High Boots.

https://www.keenfootwear.com/p/M-TARGHE ... GH-WP.html

they are simply the warmest comfiest boots i have ever warn. the look bulky, but they are lighter than any winter cycling boots i have owned.
i ride every single day, and no matter how long i have been out my feet remain warm and dry.
i were them knee length HJ HALL wool socks and they are perfect.

[sean_iow]

I think I have the answer, spotted on the ride to work. All we need is Christ the King College (sorry Shaf) blazers, worn over a white shirt and not even buttoned up they are able to keep the wearer warm on the walk to college even when its -2 out

Seriously, how do these kids not end up with hypothermia? It's a good half hour walk to school from where i saw them, though they might stop at McD's on the a for a warm.

[Shewie]

Wool felt insoles might be worth a go, popular for Arctic explorers, you'll probably need to check some Scandi stores for availability.

A DIY reflectix insole worked for me inside some Scott boots when I had crank bros double shots on my fatty

Do folk use a VBL sock for cycling? Nit sure but might work

[Raggedstone]

I was one of Sean's riding companions over the weekend and managed to have warm feet the whole time which was something I never thought I would ever be able to achieve my feet normally get painfully cold around freezing point meaning I have to walk on a regular basis to get some warmth back in them .
I took notice of what Tony said and bought some of the Columbia Fairbanks Omniheat boots last year but it wasn't cold enough for a proper test .I bought a pair of cheap thermal leggings from Mountain Warehouse along with a pair of their Merino explorer mid length socks . The thermal leggings worn under a pair of cycling trousers with Smartwool liner socks under the Merino pair along with Nukeproof Electron plastic pedals worked perfectly . Noticeably after putting the freezing cold boots on in the morning I could feel the feet warming up something none of the other multiple variations of socks and boots has ever come close to achieving .

[whitestone]

Do folk use a VBL sock for cycling? Nit sure but might work

I have done but it does need to be properly cold before a VBL system is required, usually below -5C at least. A VBL setup does work but it also introduces its own problems especially on multi-day trips, you have to dry inner socks and your feet properly every night otherwise you run the risk of trench foot

A bit US over the top style but here's a video showing some tips https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ppNWd3eAmb4 - it's actually the first listed if you search for "fat bike cold feet" on YouTube.

Nice and crispy and clear this morning, -3C apparently - I'll be heading out in a bit on another test ride. This one will simply add a set of uninsulated gaiters (I think they are Rab mountaineering gaiters) so I'll report back on whether they improve things.

[Bearbonesnorm]

To take Sean's idea a step forward - why not just dress up like a Geordie girl on a night out. Short skirt, boob tube(?) and a pair of decent heels - at least 4". You'll never be cold again.

[Raggedstone]

And the heels could double up as crampons now you're talking

[voodoo_simon]

Little bit of walking will warm up your feet

[gairym]

I also have a pair of Columbia bugaboots which are size 12, have space for two pairs of thick socks and themselves are allegedly good down to -20. When I wore these on the Rovaniemi 150 it was -5 and I got very cold feet.

Really? I'm on my second pair of Bugaboots - I absolutely love 'em!!!

Ridden in them in all conditions and temperatures down to about -20°c and never once had cold feet in them.

[fatbikephil]

Tah all. For more info when I switched to Nukeproof electron pedals a few winters ago, I thought I'd solve all my cold foot problems. It may have made a difference but in reality I couldn't feel it. Adding the bugaboots made things better for sure, and I've a feeling that as they are quite high legged, lacing them up tight may restrict blood flow to feet. The Lake boots (and the NW's) have a liner (carboard and goretex) over the cleat hole, add in a good insole and I'm not convinced you are going to lose much heat to a wee SPD pedal. I did use to think I was losing heat through pedals but I think this is a perception. Last night it was my tootsies that got cold first, not the soles of my feet. I also generally over dress and keep legs warm with long socks, Paramo trousers and gaiters. That said last night my legs were only warm when climbing so I think maybe I was a bit under dressed.....

Anyway this is all good stuff and plenty of things to try. I do think I have a congenital circulation problem. It's odd that my left foot gets cold much faster than my right. This and my left knee issues seems to date from when I did my back in, in 2016 so I wonder if nerve damage might be partly to blame.

I like those Keen boots but not the price. Will play around with the Columbias this season and see what improvements I can make.

Anyway it's to be 8 degrees on Monday after a nice big dump of snow!

I'll ignore Stu's suggestion, in the interests of not causing alarm and distress

[redefined_cycles]

Phil... look at adding regular (raw and unfiltered if you can get it... Zaytouna do a good one from the Palestine farmers and its fair trade) olive oil into your diet. Might not taste too nice at first but you get used to it and its lovely. Morning and night. Theres actually no upper limit. Some evidence is debatable (by those that like to put everything that's good down and have a right good debate) apparently but I've found it to be ace...

Do some YT vids research by various medical doctors and I'm sure it'll convince ya. Raw (not cooked please though the latest advice is slowly coming that this might actually be ok too)...

[fatbikephil]

Oof! I do like a bit of Olive Oil!
Think there is a middle eastern supermarket down the town so I'll check it out.

[redefined_cycles]

Oof! I do like a bit of Olive Oil!
Think there is a middle eastern supermarket down the town so I'll check it out.

Here we go Phil. There's lots of 'opinions' on the net (as well as with various medical and herbal folk) but here's a straight to the point vid by an endocrinologist https://youtu.be/dMba2xvzjAk

Hope it helps and for ref I used to get them 'vascular' type pains in the legs and elsewhere. Olive oil (IMHO) really did the trick for me and there's been more than a few occassions over the years I've downed a bit of Aspirin due to said pain.

I was gonna PM you but thought the vid is very holistic and doesn't provide too much 'heresay'. Get on it (extra virgin) and don't foeget that thing about cooking with high heat isn't good at all with it (hence we only eat it raw).

Lastly (it's technically all related to keeping one warm as good circulation means the 'central heating' is getting around properly), in case anyone sees any vids about using actual raw olives. We tried this for a while after thinking we'd found some 'non-dehydrated then rehydrated' olives from Turkey. But I'm pretty sure that the way this was done was by using lots of salt for preservation!! So back to raw extra virgin (Palestinian unless cost is restricting us in which case Berto whatever) olive oil we went

Should make you faster aswell

[fatbikephil]

Cheers Shaff, will check the vid out

[tobasco]

To take Sean's idea a step forward - why not just dress up like a Geordie girl on a night out. Short skirt, boob tube(?) and a pair of decent heels - at least 4". You'll never be cold again.

You need to understand Geordie lasses use a significant vodka base layer

[Alpinum]

So am I just screwed in terms of keeping feet warm or am I missing something? I've tried various thicknesses of socks, made sure my feet aren't pinched and stay dry. Any tips appreciated plus share your cold weather riding gear wisdom.

Warmest boot in my house:

https://www.bergerschuhe.ch/salomon/tou ... gJ-RPD_BwE

Not sure it gets much warmer than that, unless you go for a La Sportiva Olympus Mons Cube or so...

As a general advice on shoes/boots for warm feet;
Make sure you have no restriction in circulation, mostly meaning to size up.

Sizing up 1 or two sizes will allow for layerig with socks, add heat pads. Wear them as loosely as possible.

Especially for multiday duties it's nice to have thin socks (polypropylene) a VBL and a thick sock. This way you just have a thin damp sock to shove into your clothing over night to dry and can use the thick sock for sleeping in.
Unless things get wet from the outside (which, the colder it gets, the less likely it becomes).

Also. Massage feet in camp.
Use cream containing capsacin.
Get off the bike and walk. 10 min usually is enough.
Ankles are really important (same to wrists) for thermal regulation. Make sure to protect them.

The Salomon boots seem somewhat a standard for the cold weather riding folks running flats. Got mine after asking a mate who rode the ITI twice and have used it in similar temps (-30°C) and was well comfy with them. Shame they don't have a liner boot though.

[thenorthwind]

To take Sean's idea a step forward - why not just dress up like a Geordie girl on a night out. Short skirt, boob tube(?) and a pair of decent heels - at least 4". You'll never be cold again.

You need to understand Geordie lasses use a significant vodka base layer

I'm saving that one for personal used.

Yes, they're usually well-oiled, and not in the way Shaf suggests

[redefined_cycles]

Anyway, I know JP might not be the most popular on here but I follow him (a little) and manage to learn a thing or two. Not sure he's shared his ITI race kit before but here it is...

https://youtu.be/sdiqiqhep7w

He mentions RideCycles is the ti bike he rides... Anyone heard of it (just purely out of interest.. I'm gonna get a MOOTS one day (InshaAllah)

[redefined_cycles]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ju0veN43K1I

For completeness of (ITI JP) info