E-Bikepacking

[Pickers]

To say they shouldn't be allowed off road at all is quite a blinkered view I think. Having said that, I was certainly of that opinion right up to the point I needed one. And that changes your point of view.

It was a case of ebike riding or no riding. At all.

Ebikes it was then.

It's a double edged sword, damned if you do and damned if you don't. I had no indication on the surface that I had a very dicky ticker, and quite often had open abuse directed at me from those that didn't know me and the reasons why I had one.
It should be very illegal to chip them for any reason (I know it is illegal but...), and mechanically (electronically?) impossible. Difficult.

Even when I had to have an ebikes, I didn't really want one. I wanted to be able to ride without being tethered like I used to. And that's how I think most people here would be. I never really had any speed but I really loved just riding. And ebikes made that possible.

There's practical issues with bike packing or touring....
Battery charging - the LHC B team seemed have reputation for pub visits - handy for this if your battery is removable (the Levo was, the Orbea Gain - same kit as the Ribble above - is not)
Weight - they're bastard heavy! No getting around this although the Orbea is only 13 or 14kg I think. Obviously more if loaded, and you need to carry the charger and leads too.
Nobody else in your group has one - obvious, but if you're "the one" then there's a bit of a mismatch, however far you turn the power down.
Battery anxiety - very much a thing with the Levo. My record (riding in the Black Mountains with BDS) is 9 miles from full charge to flashing red LEDS!) Bloody big hill though! The Orbea I often ride switched off so makes little difference.

If you need one, you need one. There's not many alternatives. If you want one for whatever reason then rule 1 should be written large on the inside of your Oakleys, because it's very easy to ride like a twit.

Edit - We seem to have digressed a little from the thread. The bike you have is the right one to take bikepacking.

The Levo on a hill...
Untitled by Richard Picton, on Flickr

The Orbea in some woods...
Untitled by Richard Picton, on Flickr

[Bearbonesnorm]

Banning E-bikes from trails will do little to stop people riding E-bikes on trails ... actually, that's untrue. It will stop people who might otherwise not be able to cycle from riding on trails but it'll have little bearing on whether bell-ends on 'chipped' bikes ride on trails. It's like most laws, they're designed to curb the stupid and the majority suffer ... much better to simply shoot the stupid ones straight off.

Back on track - I'm sure there's a lot of people who perhaps only really venture out for a single night at a time and don't really cover that* much distance. Could well be that an E-bike would suit many.

*Obviously that's relative and I assume each make / model of bike to be different with regard to range.

[Richpips]

When we did our TdF trip we met a German guy who had ridden from home. He had a spare battery to extend his day’s mileage.

[rufus748]

I think it was last year when we did the Tuscany Trail there was a guy using one. He was towing a Bob trailer with 3 (?) Spare batteries in it. Didn't help him too much when the Bob got a puncture though..

[gairym]

I think it was last year when we did the Tuscany Trail there was a guy using one. He was towing a Bob trailer with 3 (?) Spare batteries in it. Didn't help him too much when the Bob got a puncture though..

I don't think it was as you didn't ride it last year!

Year before?

[fatbikephil]

Could you charge the battery off a dyno hub??

[Cheddar Man]

Could you charge the battery off a dyno hub??

Yes! DX have made a self charging hub that charges the battery when you are going down hill, or if your pedalling is greater than the draw on the battery.

Early days, but this tech is charging along.

[Tonto]

Saw a couple of groups ebike MTB touring in the Alps. Recharged batteries at lunch stops and overnight in refuges. I was a little envious.
Can see myself doing similar in my dotage.

[Gari]

“ Early days, but this tech is charging along.”
Like what you did there

[mattpage]

Interesting to read the comments, although I am not surprised by some of the views.

I've had the Kinesis Range in the picture on test recently and I was hoping there might be others to get their views and thoughts. Lots of the potential issues people assume here don't really apply.

Gates & weight... well firstly there shouldn't be gates you need to lift over for a right of way that is legal to ride. So of course we all know it happens, but the bike is about 4kg heavier than a standard gravel style bike, so not significantly heavier. If you are strong enough to lift a heavy laden bike, this will be fine.

We did a mini trip a few nights ago and it was here that the bike just seemed amazing.
For me, if it gets people out riding or riding more often, then its a good thing.

[psling]

Gates & weight... well firstly there shouldn't be gates you need to lift over for a right of way that is legal to ride. So of course we all know it happens, but the bike is about 4kg heavier than a standard gravel style bike, so not significantly heavier. If you are strong enough to lift a heavy laden bike, this will be fine.

Yep, you live in Wales and will fully appreciate the myriad ways that Welsh farmers have of fastening their gates! Lifting over can often save a half hour of time trying to unravel baling twine/wire/broken gates!!

On the weight thing I guess the type of bike can make a big difference - the gravel bike style will be a lot lighter than the mtb hardtail which again would likely be lighter than the full-on mtb. Like their equivalent non-electric cousins of course so purely a matter of choosing the best tool for the route if you are able, or the best route for the tool ( ) if not

[mattpage]

On the weight thing I guess the type of bike can make a big difference - the gravel bike style will be a lot lighter than the mtb hardtail which again would likely be lighter than the full-on mtb. Like their equivalent non-electric cousins of course so purely a matter of choosing the best tool for the route if you are able, or the best route for the tool ( ) if not

On a recent ride we had three very different bikes, from this Kinesis to a Trek Rail enduro style with a 700Wh battery. I don't think lifting that would be much fun! Think it is 25kg without kit.

[mattpage]

There's practical issues with bike packing or touring....
Battery charging - the LHC B team seemed have reputation for pub visits - handy for this if your battery is removable (the Levo was, the Orbea Gain - same kit as the Ribble above - is not)
Weight - they're bastard heavy! No getting around this although the Orbea is only 13 or 14kg I think. Obviously more if loaded, and you need to carry the charger and leads too.
Nobody else in your group has one - obvious, but if you're "the one" then there's a bit of a mismatch, however far you turn the power down.
Battery anxiety - very much a thing with the Levo. My record (riding in the Black Mountains with BDS) is 9 miles from full charge to flashing red LEDS!) Bloody big hill though! The Orbea I often ride switched off so makes little difference.

What is the Orbea like off battery? Does it completely disengage?
I didn't realise that you couldn't remove the battery on that. Can you add extra batteries on somehow?

[ScotRoutes]

Gates & weight... well firstly there shouldn't be gates you need to lift over for a right of way that is legal to ride

Do I need to comment?

There are many trail obstacles, not just gates. I guess it just depends on how tame you like your routes. I can see how an e-gravel bike might be worth looking into.



As this thread is discussing bikepacking, an added 4-5kg could easily tip the scales towards an already loaded bike being just too heavy to manhandle.

[ScotRoutes]

Oh - if I was running some sort of accommodation on the likes of the NC500 I'd be investing in a couple of chargers and offering a recharge service for punters. If enough folk did that then it would help with the charging concerns.

[Pickers]

There's practical issues with bike packing or touring....
Battery charging - the LHC B team seemed have reputation for pub visits - handy for this if your battery is removable (the Levo was, the Orbea Gain - same kit as the Ribble above - is not)
Weight - they're bastard heavy! No getting around this although the Orbea is only 13 or 14kg I think. Obviously more if loaded, and you need to carry the charger and leads too.
Nobody else in your group has one - obvious, but if you're "the one" then there's a bit of a mismatch, however far you turn the power down.
Battery anxiety - very much a thing with the Levo. My record (riding in the Black Mountains with BDS) is 9 miles from full charge to flashing red LEDS!) Bloody big hill though! The Orbea I often ride switched off so makes little difference.

What is the Orbea like off battery? Does it completely disengage?
I didn't realise that you couldn't remove the battery on that. Can you add extra batteries on somehow?

It’s genuinely as a normal bike, the hub mounted motor Isn’t really any problem when running switched off. I’ve not ridden big miles on it, longest about 50 or so using the motor on low with a little to spare. Using the battery only on when needed I’ve done mid 40s with nearly half left so that way I’d say maybe 70 or 80 miles is just possible with care. You can get an external battery for it, bottle cage fitting I’d guess similar to yours. That’s removable for recharging away from the bike.
I don’t think I’ve ever done a trip in Wales where we didn’t have to lift the bikes over something or other at some point.
Reading back through my piece from earlier it comes across a bit harsh - apologies, that wasn’t my intention.

Colin - the carrying chargers is a good idea. As above, I know that Bosch had charging stations for bikes with their motors in the Alps and similar spots. Only problem being you’d need chargers to cover the 4 or 5 main brands as they’re all specific to the motor fitted.

[mattpage]

One thing that would be really good is standardised chargers and connectors going forwards.
I am pretty sure they are all different, although the Specialized Levo is similar to the Fazua but not sure if they will charge each other.

But if Bosch, Shimano, Specialized and all other motor brands could use the same charger I am sure lots of cafes and accommodation might then invest in chargers as it would increase trade.

[rufus748]

I think it was last year when we did the Tuscany Trail there was a guy using one. He was towing a Bob trailer with 3 (?) Spare batteries in it. Didn't help him too much when the Bob got a puncture though..

I don't think it was as you didn't ride it last year!

Year before?

Maybe.. thought I did? Time flies. Defo not this year though

[woodsmith]

One thing that would be really good is standardised chargers and connectors going forwards.
I am pretty sure they are all different, although the Specialized Levo is similar to the Fazua but not sure if they will charge each other.

But if Bosch, Shimano, Specialized and all other motor brands could use the same charger I am sure lots of cafes and accommodation might then invest in chargers as it would increase trade.
[/
quote

If the motor industry can't harmonise with their massiveley more expensive infrastructure and political clout then sadly I cant see the cycle industry doing much better.

[BigdummySteve]

One thing I learnt of the black mountains trip with pickers was don’t drop a fully loaded E bike on yer face! They feel really heavy when you do that, also if you’re riding with someone using an Ebike for medical reasons insist on the bike having walk assistance, pushing a fully loaded full-sus Ebike up a huge hill could do for even the fittest.

[wriggles]

I met a guy riding the Great Divide on an e-fatbike which was a proper heavy beast. His knees were shot from carrying clients rucksacks as well as his own whilst running his walking guiding in Tasmania. He planned his day around charging points. He had a couple of hicups where he ran out of charge and had a bitter day crawling his ridiculously heavy bike just on pedal power.

One day he ran out of charge with 30 very hilly miles to the next charge point. Dejected he sat down against one of those massive ranch entrances you see made out of tree trunks. Whilst he was feeling thoroughly miserable he looked down and there was a plug socket on one of the upright trunks!

On the TNR route all the off grid refuges have e-bike charging points. Presumably fueled by solar into massive batteries.