Anybody else do this?
It's very much a minority sport as there seems to be a very small overlap of the two circles on the Venn diagram of Mountain Bikers Who Like Map Reading and Mountain Bikers Who Like Competitive Events. I wondered if it might be more popular amongst bikepackers who like to explore new areas than amongst those who prefer to follow a marked trail at a trail centre.
I'll be at the last event in the Midlands MBO series in Leicestershire next Sunday.
For those not familiar with mountain bike orienteering, it's a bit different to foot orienteering, in that riders are restricted to legal rights of way, so there's no heading off on a bearing in to the undergrowth searching for hidden markers as all the control points are generally on an obvious feature, such as a gate post, right by the side of the trail.
They are also "Score events" which means that instead of visiting all the control points in a set order and the winner being the one to do so in the shortest time, you will be given a map with more control points marked on it than it is possible to visit in the allowed time, normally three hours, and it's up to you which ones you visit and in which order.

http://www.bmbo.org.uk/calendar/

I did a few Polaris events back when, and some of the Dark and White ones more recently.

I'd rather plan my a route on maps at home, upload to my GPS, and just enjoy the riding these days.

Or of course blindly follow someone elses .gpx file.

I have often thought about an event that is:

part WRT - You get a number of control points in advance and you choose how many you go to and what your route is.
part Polaris - You get points for each control point, points may have different scores depending on distance from home base. Set time to get back and lose points for every 15mins (for instance) late
part bb200 - badges awarded for points in the same way they are awarded for time on the bb200. Minimum number of points to get a "green" badge. Would probably be tough to work out the point bands.

The great thing is that you can make it as hard as you want to. Can still be very difficult for the fast guys who want to get to as many points as possible but not make it impossible for those who want a less racy event.

I was a foot orienteer between 1974 and 1992 and loved it until injury put a stop to things. In the late '90's started doing a few TQ's for a couple of years getting a couple of placings in 40+ class (including an event organised by pistonbroke) and second in a summer series at Cannock ~10 years ago.

I stopped because weekends were not great for me as I am in a long distance relationship. On top of that I was driving for hours to ride for hours on my own to drive hours home and I just get fed up of the driving! Did a couple of enduro's which were just starting and enjoyed them for a time as well.

I now enjoy the odd BB event and riding in the week and seeing Mrs B at the weekends. I would like to do the Dark & White event but never check the calendar when I do get a weekend free. I quite fancy having a ride out in an MBO event sometime and Leicestershire is close to me but I go on holiday tomorrow.

Apart from the badges thing, you've pretty much described mountain bike orienteering, Composite.
I've never understood why Polaris is considered a must do cool event, while MBO is dismissed as being too geeky.

Not a very clear picture, but this gives some idea of what's involved.
The values of the control points varies. Starting from the triangle, you've got three hours to get as high a score as possible.
I think I made this one a bit too hard. With 600 points available, only two riders scored over 300.

The main difference as I saw it was being able to plan the route before hand.

The badges thing would be to take it from racing against each other to racing against yourself like the bb200.

What used to be Midland Trailquests is now Midlands MBO, a local club within BMBO.
As such, we have standardised on BMBO's system of having unmarked maps of the area available to view before the start, but you don't get your map with the control points and values marked on it until after you have clocked out. All route planning is done in your own time while the clock is ticking.

I think the concept of Mountain bike orienteering is great .... but, as things stand I don't think it'll ever appeal to the masses for a number of reasons.

1/ At present it's 'out of fashion' ... but this could change over time.
2/ The terms 'orienteering' and 'trail quest' don't do it any favours ... one sounds dull and the other sounds like some kind of fantasy role playing game.
3/ A very high percentage of mountain bikers can't actually read a map.
4/ A very high percentage of mountain bikers don't have a competitive nature.
5/ To get the most from it requires a level of effort and input that most people aren't willing to give. It doesn't offer instant gratification in the way a couple of hours round a trail centre does.

I understand that I've 'answered' a question you didn't ask - sorry.

You know that they call golf a good walk spoiled?

I raced Trailquests in the south for years and did the odd Polaris as well. Really enjoyed these events as you could win on brain power instead of just leg brawn.

It all ended when my racing partner was paralysed descending the gap trail in 2003 at the time we were leading the mens pairs competition with two races left. I had to enter these final two with ringers and win the last one so that Russ could get his trophy (by forcing our closest rivals to lose points accordingly), we managed it and Russ announced to a bemused Stoke Mandeville ward that he had just won a mountain bike race. Think they upped his medication after that.

I remember them as events with great community spirit, seems to be almost dead down south now though as the main organiser found more money in road sportives.

I wonder if there is scope for an event which is a cross between a trail quest and a normal adventure race with a fixed route. This would add navigation skills into the mix and get away from the requirement to stick to a fixed track. So you have to reach a number of check points but its up to you how you do it. The check points are located such that you are still following a circuit but you don't have to worry about going off route and then having to back track to the point you left. You can also choose to cross rivers where you feel happiest rather than where the GPX file tells you to!

Isn't the Transcontinental like that (on a larger scale)?

I'm putting on a club event next autumn that will be for runners, road and mtb bikes based on that.

'Par' will be that the CP are c. 1 hour apart folk can choose 3,4,5 or 6 to visit. The quickest to visit the chosen number of controls in the shortest time wins.

It will based from the duddon valley if anyone is interested in coming

htrider wrote:I wonder if there is scope for an event which is a cross between a trail quest and a normal adventure race with a fixed route. This would add navigation skills into the mix and get away from the requirement to stick to a fixed track. So you have to reach a number of check points but its up to you how you do it. The check points are located such that you are still following a circuit but you don't have to worry about going off route and then having to back track to the point you left. You can also choose to cross rivers where you feel happiest rather than where the GPX file tells you to!

Sounds like a mountain marathon on wheels

Ianfitz, be careful with the legality of that.
Mountain bike orienteering is a "navigation event" all be it with a time limit. It's not a race, as it is illegal to hold a bicycle race or time trial on a bridleway.
That's why Man v Horse had to drop the bikes as it is a straightforward race.

VeganGraham wrote:Ianfitz, be careful with the legality of that.
Mountain bike orienteering is a "navigation event" all be it with a time limit. It's not a race, as it is illegal to hold a bicycle race or time trial on a bridleway.
That's why Man v Horse had to drop the bikes as it is a straightforward race.

It will be a very small event and not advertised any where other than in the club events list (and a cheeky mention on here) plus its based out of the duddon valley where no-one ever goes!

I realise it is a bit close to the wind to do as a public event...

Regarding S8tannorm's points;

Mountain biking fashions can change. CX and fat bikes are becoming cool, not just oddities now. The change won't be industry led, as you don't need a different bike and I doubt it will be magazine led as promoting MBO might possibly put them at the forefront of a new fashion, or more likely leave them looking unfashionable.

As I understand it, "Trailquest" as a word was invented when the Midlands group broke away from BMBO a long time ago as a means of differentiating themselves from the national club. We're all back together now and Midlands MBO is part of BMBO and the word Trailquest is obsolete.
"Orienteering" isn't much better in some people's eyes. What we need is a cool name that the kidz will love, like Rural Alley Cat Races, or something.

Like I said at the start anything that involves mountain biking and mapreading and competition is always going to be a minority pastime.
Most cyclists like to have their riding spoon fed to them. HONC can sell out 1200 places in 3 hours, yet ride the same bridleways any other Sunday and it feels like you've got the whole Cotswolds to yourself.

As for input and gratification, it's not all that different to any other sport. The big difference is that you have no idea how well you're doing until the end. At any point, your closest rival could be 10km away and riding in the other direction. I like this, I guess it's a bit like time trialling, but I can see how some people would miss the feeling of being part of a race and chasing down the rider in front.

If you could make it the 'Crikey, how much something or other' or the 'Strava whatever' you'd be fighting 'em off with a shitty stick

I used to do loads of trailquests (in fact I was Midland champion for a year or 2 ), and they are a great excuse to ride in areas you would never normally go to. A 3,4 or 5 hour event is a blimmin good workout, anything less than 3 is an all out sprint. They teach you how to read a map on the move, how to travel efficiently (always know which side of a gate the catch is on, which way you are going after you get to a control, etc, but eventually I just migrated to different sorts of events.

Many events go through phases, Polaris's used to have 500 riders, now they are lucky to break 100; XC races are having a resurgence; enduros seem to be the new fad. I think that if MTBO events updated themselves to somehow use gps or something like that they could become popular, but they may have to only use classic riding places (trail centres, Peak District, Cannock etc)

But the fact that riders have to plan, think and be competitive and then be frustrated when they get lost or make mistakes will always mean they are a small minority sport. The vast majority of riders are lazy and just want to turn up, ride good trails, have a social natter and go home for cake, so this will limit entrants.

Check out this blog it might be of interest.

http://www.stodgell.co.uk