First bike help

[deejayen]

I’ve whittled the list down to around six… Looking to buy a first MTB (I’m a regular road cyclist). After learning some basic skills I’d like to do some long-ish off-road rides (probably some sections of the HT550, seeing as I live in the area). I’d like to try singlespeeding at some point… I’d probably experiment with handlebars (On One Mary / Jones etc). I’d appreciate comments to let me know if any of these are particularly good or bad:

Islabikes Beinn 29 £450 +upgrade to MTB tyres, so probably around £500. Strangely, this one appeals – it looks like a real bike! It got a thumbs-up in a STW review – in comparison with suspended bikes in the same price bracket. V-brakes seem fine to me (used XTR with Swissstop pads on a road bike), and I could upgrade components. It has sliding dropouts, so SS compatible. 26lbs

Voodoo Bizango – from Halfords. £600, but should be able to get it discounted to £500 or less. Again, this gets good reviews. 120mm Suntour fork. Sliding drop-outs. I don’t really like the colour or the voodoo theme with text and logos. 30lbs

Cannondale Trail 29er SS - £750 – available for £640-ish. Eccentric BB. Stans rims. Massive alloy fork, apparently with room for a Rabbit Hole rim and Knard tyre if the front end needed softening, although that would add £300. Supposedly the brakes aren’t great, but I could fit quality pads, and I can’t see them being totally ineffective… The black/blue theme is a bit excessive, but generally the bike looks fine, and seems good value. 24lbs

Singular/Stooge/etc – buy a steel 29er frameset and go for a basic build at around £1200 total. These generally get good reviews by owners. Value for money is lower than off-the-shelf bikes.

Surly Krampus – around £1500-£1700 – people seem to like these. They’re not the lightest, and maybe require a bit more effort on all-day rides, but supposed to be fast, especially in corners.

Jones diamond frame – not much change from £2000, and possibly a bit more if fitting a 29+ front wheel. It’s the only one I’ve ridden, and I really like the handling of this bike, but it’s expensive. The proprietary front hub is a negative.

Of course, there are piles of alternatives, including mainstream bikes such as the Trek Stache, or the Salsa El Mariachi range etc.

One local bike shop recommends the Jones (they know I like it), and although they’ve convinced me it’s great value (compared with a carbon Santa Cruz!) it still seems a lot of money for the basic model. It could well be the wisest choice, but I’m not 100% I’ll take to riding off-road. The Islabikes and Cannondale prices are easier to swallow, and they would get me out on the trail and learning the MTB ropes. On the other hand, they might be awful to ride and put me off…

Input much appreciated!

[Bearbonesnorm]

Well you've picked a real cross section, everything from V brakes to a Jones I'm sure non of what I've said will be of any use in helping you decide but you never know.

Islabikes Beinn 29 £450 +upgrade to MTB tyres, so probably around £500. Strangely, this one appeals – it looks like a real bike! It got a thumbs-up in a STW review – in comparison with suspended bikes in the same price bracket. V-brakes seem fine to me (used XTR with Swissstop pads on a road bike), and I could upgrade components. It has sliding dropouts, so SS compatible. 26lbs

The V brakes would be a big turn off. Discs allow you to control the bike in ways V brakes can't. It's a fair price but I think fitting V brakes is a massive oversight ... you might as well buy a secondhand 10 year old bike for £100.

Voodoo Bizango – from Halfords. £600, but should be able to get it discounted to £500 or less. Again, this gets good reviews. 120mm Suntour fork. Sliding drop-outs. I don’t really like the colour or the voodoo theme with text and logos. 30lb

30lb is quite heavy. Obviously you could put it on a diet but that costs ... while the fork's okay you might find it doesn't last that long or perform too well ... ebay is full of s/h Voodoos.

Cannondale Trail 29er SS - £750 – available for £640-ish. Eccentric BB. Stans rims. Massive alloy fork, apparently with room for a Rabbit Hole rim and Knard tyre if the front end needed softening, although that would add £300. Supposedly the brakes aren’t great, but I could fit quality pads, and I can’t see them being totally ineffective… The black/blue theme is a bit excessive, but generally the bike looks fine, and seems good value. 24lbs

Actually a very nice bike. They ride well and have a reasonable spec ... if you found the fork a bit harsh a £150 set of carbon rigids would help smooth it out. If you're happy enough to go SS then on paper this one's for you.

Singular/Stooge/etc – buy a steel 29er frameset and go for a basic build at around £1200 total. These generally get good reviews by owners. Value for money is lower than off-the-shelf bikes.

This is a difficult one because no two builds will be the same. If you've a reasonable idea of what you want at the end then it could be ideal. I reckon if you're handy with the spanners it'd be possible to turn something out for under a grand with careful shopping. There's also a decent chance of selling the frame later too.

Surly Krampus – around £1500-£1700 – people seem to like these. They’re not the lightest, and maybe require a bit more effort on all-day rides, but supposed to be fast, especially in corners.

Any bike with wheels that big / heavy should be fast. I think they actually ride better than they should, they're not light by any stretch but oddly people don't seem to struggle too much ... Burty from this parish and Shona / Rich from keep Pedaling ride them SS.

Jones diamond frame – not much change from £2000, and possibly a bit more if fitting a 29+ front wheel. It’s the only one I’ve ridden, and I really like the handling of this bike, but it’s expensive. The proprietary front hub is a negative.

Hand on heart ... if you're not sure you'll take to mountain biking I'd leave it alone. Obviously if you didn't get on you could sell it fairly easily but it won't be for a profit. They're superb frames and in the main I believe what people say about them is true but only you can decide if it's worth it.

[jameso]

With a disclaimer that I work for Pinnacle, this is what this bike is made for.
http://www.evanscycles.com/products/pin ... e-ec055206
£500 now down to £400. Not a lot of cash, not flash or trying to jam a load of spec that's unrealistic at this price level, a try-the-waters or just-for-winter bike that's upgradeable and also fun as it is out of the box. In your situation I'd recommend something like it over a Jones etc. It's thinking time and riding experience for less than a set of good forks? (edit to add, I have a Jones and the Ramin rigid doesn't ride like a Jones. At all. But with H-bars on and the stock 52mm offset fork it's not as miles-away as a lot of other 29ers I've ridden either)

Others with sus forks on discount at the mo also.

[deejayen]

Thanks very much, Stuart. That's extremely helpful. It's nudged me towards the Cannondale! I was aware of a shop with a limited time 15% sale on bikes, and ended up paying a deposit just before the end of the sale tonight. They need to order it in from Cannondale and then build it up, but they'll be able to send it to a store within driving distance so that I can check it out for size and everything. Of course, it's likely that 2014 models will be discounted heavily within the next few weeks - assuming there are any of these models left. Still it's not a bad price, and I think I'd struggle to build up a frameset for anything near this - some of the equipment seems fairly decent (eg Stans tubeless compatible rims and Schwalbe Racing Ralph tyres etc). It will also let me try singlespeed, and there's a gear hanger available for the bike if it turns out I'd prefer gears... I can't believe I've made a decision!

[Bearbonesnorm]

Hooray

Just remember that it (and nearly everything else) will feel very different to the Jones you rode, so approach it with an open mind.

If the 'dale doesn't work out for you then I'd give serious consideration to the Pinnacle as James suggests. I've seen one in the flesh and they're very nice.

I assume the 'dale comes with 32 x 18 gearing? You might want to invest in a 19t or maybe even a 20t considering where you live

[jameso]

The Cannondale is a good choice. SSs are for winners! : )

[ScotRoutes]

I recommended the Pinnacle on the other thread already - although I suggested the Ramin Two as you might want suspension forks.

I should state that I also work for a bike shop and we don't sell these, so there's no need to think my opinion is in any way biased.

[composite]

Out of that list I would definitely be going for the Stooge. Seeing it in the flesh at WRT gave me a woody.

[johnnystorm]

Out of that list I would definitely be going for the Stooge. Seeing it in the flesh at WRT gave me a woody.

And that was why we made you sleep outside the cabin.

Those 'dales look great. If the brakes are duff then Deores for £70 are s bargain. When you get it, set it up tubeless. Might be an idea to buy a big 2.35 Racing Ralph or Nobby Nic to go on the front and keep the spare small front one for the rear.

[Bearbonesnorm]

Out of that list I would definitely be going for the Stooge. Seeing it in the flesh at WRT gave me a woody.

I tend to be forgetful so when my frame arrives can everyone please remind me to keep out of Neils way (or at least ride at the back) - ta.

[AlasdairMc]

Does anyone ever start out on either rigid forks or single speed these days? If you're not used to either, you run the risk of putting yourself off MTB early on.

How tall are you and how close to Edinburgh are you? I've got a rigid SS and a geared front suspension version of the same bike, so you're welcome to give both a shot to see if you still want to go down the SS route.

[FLV]

I like the look of the 'dale

I hope you get on with the SS version, it is (as someone on here once said to me) a different mindset than riding geared. you have to be ready to walk up some things. It took me a while to get used to, though I can get up most stuff round our way, once tired, there's no escape.

Like you say, theres always a geared hanger.
A deore / slx rear mech, cassette and shifter (staying single front ring) can be installed for approx £100 and you're 10 speed.

Enjoy your bike, ride and have fun.

[FLV]

oh, and in the hilly peak. 32-19 is my limit on 29er.

I ride a salsa el mariachi rigid, 3.0 front, 2.4 rear generally at the moment

[jameso]

Does anyone ever start out on either rigid forks or single speed these days? If you're not used to either, you run the risk of putting yourself off MTB early on.

SS yes, agreed it's not the best place to start unless you're already fit from road riding.
Rigid though? No reason why not. Loads of us started out on rigid bikes that were junk compared to what's available for a similar RRP now with inflation. Battering along rough paths on a simple rigid bike is a great feeling, it's what hooked me at an early age and I think part of why I've gone back to rigid bikes for 90% of my riding. Very personal stuff tho and agreed that sus forks may be an easier intro.

[FLV]

Does anyone ever start out on either rigid forks or single speed these days? If you're not used to either, you run the risk of putting yourself off MTB early on.

SS yes, agreed it's not the best place to start unless you're already fit from road riding.
Rigid though? No reason why not. Loads of us started out on rigid bikes that were junk compared to what's available for a similar RRP now with inflation. Battering along rough paths on a simple rigid bike is a great feeling, it's what hooked me at an early age and I think part of why I've gone back to rigid bikes for 90% of my riding. Very personal stuff tho and agreed that sus forks may be an easier intro.

Well put.

[deejayen]

Thanks for all the helpful comments. I’m still not 100% sure about it, but I’ve got a bit of time to think about it. Maybe I should get in touch with Mr Stooge for a build price…

Perhaps SS is daft for a beginner, but I just fancy having a go. I used to ride fixed wheel, and managed some pretty hilly rides. I’m riding a recumbent these days, which uses different muscles, and no doubt my core strength will be less than it was.

Initially I’ll probably take the bike down to Aviemore for a few rides, starting off on the smoother tracks. I fancy doing a loop up the Logging Way, past the Ryvoan Bothy, and back along the Speyside Way. After that I’d like to do the Burma Road, and then build up from there. I’m not really sure what I or a SS rigid bike will be capable of. I’ll probably take a few lessons as well.

I did have a couple of short rides on some Santa Cruz bikes last year, and didn’t immediately feel at home with the isolated reaction of the front suspension. When I rode a steel Jones spaceframe/truss-fork in comparison it felt utterly fabulous – like a real bike, but with amazingly neutral and accurate steering and balance.

The Cannondale has 33x20 gearing. I don’t know what sort of rear hub it has – whether it’s a singlespeed hub with a screw-on freewheel, or if it’s a standard cassette hub with a spaced single cog. The info about the larger front tyre is helpful.

Thanks for your generous offer, Alasdair. I’m 6ft. However, I’m near Inverness, and I don’t think I’ll be able to make it down to Edinburgh in the near future.

[chris n]

When I got back into MTBing a few years ago I went straight to SS - a rigid Inbred 29er. Like you, I'd been riding fixed on road and figured that it couldn't be that hard.

I'm also buying an MTB at the moment and was looking at similar rigid bikes - though I need a geared bike for lugging my son around that can be reconfigured to SS for MTBing. I looked at the Cannondale, Jones, Stooge etc but settled on a Salsa El Mariachi in the end which I'll build myself.

The Cannondale has a mini-cassette hub - Formula DC52:

So easy enough to fit different cogs like the Surly SS cogs to change the ratio.

[Bearbonesnorm]

I don't think it's daft to start off on SS. Yes it can be hard work at times but it can also be very rewarding and great fun ... the same can be said for riding rigid too. These days the only bike I own with suspension is the bike I coach on (still a hardtail) and that's really because a lot of people expect certain things and me riding a rigid bike would give quite a few of those people the wrong idea / impression (sad but true)

33 x 20 sounds like a good place to start with gearing.

[ScotRoutes]

When you want to do the Glenmore/Ryvoan/Nethybridge loop, let me know.That's one of my regulars.

[deejayen]

Thanks, ScotRoutes - that would be good.

Thanks for the previous comments, and picture of the hub etc.

I subscribed to STW in order to read a review of last year's Cannondale, and they concluded with a double thumbs-up-recommendation. They were very positive about it - apparently it's fast, light, and comfortable (for a rigid) and puts the rider in a great neutral position.