The Famous Grouse in Scotland

[Richpips]

A local Peak rider has just mentioned nesting birds in the Peak. There are always grouse around here.

I heard cuckoos everyday on the HTR, but only saw two startled grouse.

Do they still breed and shoot them up in Scotland?

Not that we visited all of it.

[ScotRoutes]

Around a million of them. There is a real problem with an increasing number of hill tracks being bulldozed in to get to them. You'll also see the tell-tale signs of burnt heather strips on hill and moor.

Grouse shooting is worth around £30m to the Scottish Economy.

[ianfitz]

Not that we visited all of it.

After riding that route you've not got much of svorland left to see now

[mountainbaker]

The whole grouse industry stinks. Subsidised heavily for the benefit of the rich, the torching of moorland causes flooding etc etc. They should reintroduce wolves. HTR would be more interesting then.

[24tom]

R.e. ScotRoute's post. Very depressing blog post written by Chris Townsend sums up the current situation well.

http://www.christownsendoutdoors.com/20 ... lands.html

[Richpips]

The whole grouse industry stinks. Subsidised heavily for the benefit of the rich, the torching of moorland causes flooding etc etc. They should reintroduce wolves. HTR would be more interesting then.

I thought at the time that if it wasn't for the estates a lot of the doubletrack would not be there.

[Ray Young]

Grouse shooting is worth around £30m to the Scottish Economy.

Which goes to rich land owners who own vast tracts of land and employ very few people. They tried to introduce a grouse from I believe China at one point as they had bigger broods and were better able to look after themselves, problem was they flew higher and faster than the grouse we have now so the gun toting toff's couldn't hit them. Must be a real thrilling sport that takes loads of skill to shoot slow, low flying birds out of the sky that have been driven directly towards you in large numbers while you hide in your camouflaged shooting box with a gun that fires two shots of wide spreading pellets .

[mountainbaker]

Well said Ray. Here's a good write up on another way the state funds toffs guns, and pours farming subsidies back into game estates (which aren't farms). http://www.monbiot.com/2014/04/28/the-shooting-party/

[Matt]

Not a easy subject really, Toffs shooting animals is not good but it creates a demand and therefore money for a local economy that probably needs to create demands best it can. Plenty of Chavs with cash doing this as well now, it's not just Lord Fauntleroy types. Shooting and Stalking is very fashionable among the Essex set.

Sometimes it's too easy to leave our towns and head into the hills and then criticise the way in which the economy works there because we don't like the way it looks.

To a lot of people it's factory floor not just a Leisure destination.

[mountainbaker]

I live in the countryside, and there's lots of pheasant shoots around here. Trust me, it'd be a nicer place without them.

[Ian]

Sometimes it's too easy to leave our towns and head into the hills and then criticise the way in which the economy works there because we don't like the way it looks

With you 100% on this.

I have to say that while in the highlands, I was surprised at the amount of development going on in terms of powerlines and such like. The Corrieyarick Pass, for example, destroyed* by some massive powerline infrastructure and associated track works. But, its supplying much needed electricity to the poor, so I guess its OK



* its not really destroyed, it just has lots of pylons running through it now so it doesn't look as nice.

[Pickers]

I'm amazed it's only £30m to be honest, perhaps they should look at something more lucrative, such as cycling for instance... http://www.transformscotland.org.uk/val ... eport.aspx worth up to £239m apparently

[ScotRoutes]

Sometimes it's too easy to leave our towns and head into the hills and then criticise the way in which the economy works there because we don't like the way it looks

With you 100% on this.

I have to say that while in the highlands, I was surprised at the amount of development going on in terms of powerlines and such like. The Corrieyarick Pass, for example, destroyed* by some massive powerline infrastructure and associated track works. But, its supplying much needed electricity to the poor, so I guess its OK



* its not really destroyed, it just has lots of pylons running through it now so it doesn't look as nice.

There have been pylons through the Corrieyairack for decades.

How old are you exactly?

[ianfitz]

Glad to see the monbiot article linked. It makes me wildly cross


http://www.monbiot.com/2014/04/28/the-shooting-party/

[Ian]

There have been pylons through the Corrieyairack for decades.

How old are you exactly?

Yes, I know :)
They are upgrading them though, and with that comes quite a lot of ground work and disturbance. The new pylons are substantially larger than the old ones, because that's what the network requires, I guess.

I think when I did the HTR last year the line going over the top somewhere north of Fort Augustus was new, and again a high perceived visual impact compared to what I see in Wales.

Its a double edge sword though. Part of Chris Townsend's article is about creation of new tracks across the hillside and the landscape impact that results. However, these create access opportunities both for the Estates and walkers/cyclists alike and allow access to areas we wouldn't necessarily have been able to access previously. There is a substantial investment on the part of the Estate to lay that infrastructure, which it wouldn't be able to do if it's wider activities (that is, grouse shooting or deer stalking) was not profitable. E.g the track up Glen Golly and back down off the top of the Bealach Horn.

My point - albeit made indirectly - was that adverse landscape impact in Scotland, in my view, is not solely due to the activities of the Estates in their pursuit of gunning down reared birds, or stalking deer for sport. There's seems to be greater acceptance of "development" and upgrading of infrastructure though wilderness areas that is at least equal in scale or impact to sporting interests that Estates have.

I'm 38, by the way

[ianfitz]

Was talking to an engineer who specialises in energy distribution while traveling back from highlands a few weeks ago.

She said that the current crop of pylons really should be the last as cable tech and trenching becomes more useable. The thing that will do it is the unforeseen costs of installing towers (ITK phrase for pylons) which seems to be exponential factored to the height if them...

Is masses of development in this currently due to growth in renewables sector

[ScotRoutes]

On the "double edged sword"...

I can just imagine a group of Highlanders standing around in the early 1700's watching General Wade's soldiers - "Ochone, ochone Donald. Things will chust never be the same with all these new-fangled roads"

[fatbikephil]

We can't have it always - without the estate management there would be no hill tracks and no stalking paths plus the heather would be 3' high in between the areas of impenetrable forest. So you have a pristine environment full of lots of flora and fauna, but you can't access it....

A balance is required and hopefully more and more estates will go into community trusts as time goes on. There will always be awkward buggers tho and the problem with big landowners is that one awkward bugger can cause an awful lot of problems. In the meantime use your access rights and get out and ride!

To get back tot he original post as I was picking my way along the vague line of the Comyns road on Sunday I came across loads of wee grouse chicks - awwww!

[ScotRoutes]

Well done on doing Comyns Road btw. I walked it many years ago. I think there were fewer suitable tracks to follow then. I do recall finding a wee terrace on the hillside after trudging through heather for a couple of miles (past Sron a Cleirich I think) and being very pleased with myself that I'd obviously been following the correct route.

[Mart]

Is masses of development in this currently due to growth in renewables sector

Very often the location for sighting things like wind turbines is not in the most favourable position when you consider that you have to link it into the existing grid network
Whilst I support the use of renewables, i dont think the disturbance and destruction of the wild areas of Britian in the relentless pursuit of this, is the way forward

When you look at the unit cost of the electricity produced by renewables against that produced by say a Coal Fired powerstation, its significantly more expensive
Just look at your local provider who will probably have a 'Green' tarriff, which whilst appealing to peoples conservation principles, hits you in the pocket £££

Oh sorry... you nearly had me ranting there. I could go on .... but I do feel passionately about the wild places being wild and remaining that way as much as possible
For those not familiar with the vision that John Muir had all those years ago, have a look here. As a scot and a conservationalist, im sure he would be truning in his grave

http://www.jmt.org/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Muir

[Bearbonesnorm]

Don't get me started on turbines / pylons ... I will just say that if we spent a tiny fraction on educating people to use less power, then we wouldn't need to defile what's left of our wild(er) places.