So what would your ideal shelter look like? If you were designing something, what ideas would you incorporate - bug netting to keep the winged teeth out? Detatchable groundsheet? Would it be a simple ridge shape or something more complicated? How about using a lightweight pole or maybe two? Big enough for two people or solo use only? How high, high enough to sit up?

Go on what ideas have you got ... there's enough people on here that have spent enough miserable nights under tarps for there to be a few ideas, mods and imporovements

Quite like IanB's Zpacks cuben tarp thingumajig, maybe with an optional bug nest if its got to be ground shelter but otherwise my new Blackbird seems to be the dogs do dah's.

I have several ideas based on different trips...

Single night; close to home. Enough shelter to keep the rain off my face and some kit. 2x 1.5 tarp is good - can be used as a ridge / lean too / flying v if it is wet/ sunny / windy respectively.

2 nights - good weather the above would do - weight and pack size become more important.

2 nights questionable weather then more protection is useful - the laser comp outer skin (with myog groundsheet) was ace on the BB200.

I'm planning on doing a longer trip this year - perhaps 4/5 nights out if i could guarentee it would be dry any of the above would do - as i won't be able to guarentee that then i am thinking about making something that looks more like a traditional tent that allows me to camp in campsites (if it's bad weather i'd like the option of a shower and a pub meal) pack size and weight are key here. I have been looking at some of the uber lightweight options from the states - MLD etc. although i am still toying with the idea of making my own abomination

bugs and midges are nota massive concern of mine - they don't tend to bite me a lot - and we don'y have them v. often down south.

:D

Personally I think the shelter market is covered, with so many configurations of tarps being designed stateside, I also think with our damp climate the tarp best suited to the UK would have to have some form of groundsheet, etc. so we end up with a tent, so my ideal shelter would have to be a TN Laser Ultra. Alternatively, for a fine evening the Integral Designs Bugabivy stops me being feasted on by midges and is super lightweight so gets a big nod as a great shelter! So a fine night maybe a simple tarp over the bugabivy, crappy UK weather a framed bivy or TN Laser Comp, Photon or Ultra.

I know what you mean about Lasers but for me they've got a few drawbacks ... cost, lack of space (head room), and can be fiddly to set up well.

I don't think adding a groundsheet to a tarp makes it a tent, just a more comfy tarp

But ultimately I think all shelters have their drawbacks! The Lasers are a pain to pitch but are pretty sturdy when up. Weight is good, and wise shoppping can get a bargain, my Comp was cheap, hence it became do I pay more for the weight saving. I couldn't justify it when it's a couple of bars of chocolate

The tarp is a pain to pitch to, and then when you add up the price of bivvy bag, tarp and groundsheet it's getting towards a price of the a Laser, my setup; PHD Sleeping Bag Cover, Integral Designs SilTarp and Groundsheet, add in dyneema for the guys it was withing £30-40 of the cost of the Laser Comp

So based on that the Vaude Bivvy I got in the sale must be my ideal shelter; cheap, reasonable weight, weatherproof and easy to pitch :)

DNF just how breathable are the Vaude bivvies? ... my experience of enclosing yourself fully in any bivvy (even eVent) tends to lead to a slightly damp night

It matched my Laser Comp, some condensation warm still night, better on a breezy evening. The design has vents head and toe, and a extra vent at the head, you can play with the zips and vent differently. Even fully closed, you have mesh vents protected by storm covers. I'll be bringing it along in January if you want to have a look

Travel lodge :)

I'm wondering about this ATM - my army issue tarp is OK but culd be a bit lighter so I've been looking at the options. I thought I'd settled on going for a hooped bivi - the Rab Ridge Raider or the Terra Nova Jupiter but that won't work if I've got my 13yr old with me - he's getting into this bikepacking lark so I need something that'll accomodate us together. The GoLite Shangrila looks ideal - Light enough to carry as a (very spacious) solo but big enough for 2 (or 3 at a push if my daughter comes along) - in the meantime I think I'll end up with one of the cheap l/w tarps on ebay .

Talking of Shangri la 3's, has anybody seen any good deals on them.

Talking of Shangri la 3's, has anybody seen any good deals on them.

Hardly ever see them discounted, you do come across offers with the net inner though from time to time. I don't have a Go-lite inner but will get an Ook Works nest at some point ... makes much more sense than a full inner.

A Pyra tent from Bear Paw Designs is pretty much the same thing and John will carry out any mods or alterations you like ... bug net skirt, etc. Seem to be working out to just under £120 at the moment.

http://www.bearpawwd.com/tents_tarps/pyraTent.html