Ok maybe a daft q but does anyone know much about alternatives to the std cycling shorts / baggies?
I'm not convinced that padded shorts are good for long, minimal-equipment trips, especially with baggies over the top. Too hot and close-fitting and that's where sores come from. They may be the best option but I'd like to try something like a 3/4 short that's made of thin wax cotton or something like that (lighter than a Barbour of course), after hearing how cotton-duck bags stay dry. With thin close-fitting wool undies. Breathable, water-proof enough and something that can be worn as normal clothes.
A quick google didn't find anything obvious so is this just another thing like SPDs where we all use what racers use out of habit, or simply a bad idea?

Not daft at all ... firstly I don't wear any sort of padded shorts or under shorts, just baggies. I've got a pair of Mace shorts which feel a little like proofed cotton (although I'm sure they're some kind of synthetic material). They're not waterproof but very water resistant and they never 'wet-out' so remain comfortable when it's raining, they also seem very hard wearing.

I've just managed to read the faded label and it tells me the model is 'Evac'. I imagine they're no longer available though. Anyway here's a pic ... I know they look like denim but they don't behave like it.

One option might be to get some Ventile shorts made, there's a few UK companies who still use it.

Good to know, ta. I found something about linseed oil and wax for treating shorts too. I could try ditching the lycra while using normal baggies but I hate the way they wet out and that'd be guaranteed nether-chaffage.

Don't Howies do Epic cotton?

Waxing cotton makes it waterproof but not breathable. The more wax it has the less breathable it is, buts it's very robust - You could take a fall it in and probably brush off the dirt without any detriment. Might be ok in baggies as the fabric movement would help with venting but not so good if cut fairly close

You could always try waxing your own pair of cotton shorts, neve done it myself but certainly no reason why it wouldn't work. Would also make the shorts quite heavy though

Epic cotton has individually coated fibres so might work well

Don't think I'd be happy in ventile shorts as in the wet they'd get to stiff and they take an age to dry (single ventile smock and double ventile jacket owner here). Very windproof though and its pure cotton it's pretty robust and comfy against the skin

I seem to recall reading something in an audax mag some years ago along these lines but unable to recall brand name, they were UK based I recall.

Vulpine also use Epic cotton but only in standard short length.

I have not had an real issues with sores over the years but I often use chamois cream or A&E cream for longer jaunts.

I only have one pair of baggies that "wet-out" the rest are so light that they don't have that annoying saturated feel but if I was going to wax my own I would probably only bother with the front of the thighs and a patch at the back to stop wet arse. I would have thought this would still leave them fairly breathable?

About chaffing though I only ever get sore when I wear my cheap commuter padded shorts for long rides. I have a couple of pairs nice quality bibs with a good pad that don't make me sore that I use on the long ones. If it's to hot for baggys on top, I don't wear baggies on top.

I seem to recall reading something in an audax mag some years ago along these lines

I did thing the CTC site would be the place for this kind of thing )

Points noted on breathability etc, ta. I've used the usual creams (Sudocrem's the best ime) and don't use baggies if it's warm, or very thin light ones, but can't help thinking creams and all that are a faff and only needed to solve a problem caused by the shorts in the first place since whatever I do, long rides only become uncomfortable due to heat/pressure sore spots that seem unavoidable at times (ie multi-day, 12hrs a day kind of trips). Creating air space and venting may do the job, I'm out of the saddle often enough. I notice how cooling/fresh a breeze feels after a few long days ,some shorts feel a lot less wind-resistant than others. (No chuckling at the back..) and I think less close-fitting, easy-vented and natural fibres may mean no cream needed, no having to remove shorts in your sleeping bag, feeling normal when walking into a 'character-full bar at 10pm for food.. etc. Just thinking in type here really.

Points noted on breathability etc, ta. I've used the usual creams (Sudocrem's the best ime) and don't use baggies if it's warm, or very thin light ones, but can't help thinking creams and all that are a faff and only needed to solve a problem caused by the shorts in the first place since whatever I do, long rides only become uncomfortable due to heat/pressure sore spots that seem unavoidable at times (ie multi-day, 12hrs a day kind of trips). Creating air space and venting may do the job, I'm out of the saddle often enough. I notice how cooling/fresh a breeze feels after a few long days ,some shorts feel a lot less wind-resistant than others. (No chuckling at the back..) and I think less close-fitting, easy-vented and natural fibres may mean no cream needed, no having to remove shorts in your sleeping bag, feeling normal when walking into a 'character-full bar at 10pm for food.. etc. Just thinking in type here really.

I find all that to be the case. As I said up there ^ I don't wear anything underneath baggies, don't use any creams or potions and I'm sure 'gettin' some air round 'em' allows me to pretty much keep my shorts on for extended periods of time with no ill effects inc' sleeping in them if need be*.

I think the loose fitting pretty much negates the breathability issues.

*maybe i've got an arse like leather and a cast iron weld but I don't think so

Ventile, whilst a lovely fabric in some respects would be god-awful for shorts I ssupect, similar reasons to those posted above. As part of how it works relies on it absorbing water it's then a right bugger to keep warm. A boarding trip using Howies ventile jacket was a really uncomfortable experience, it's the only time I felt "let down" by gear on a mountain, and I've boarded in much cheaper stuff.

I've a couple of pairs of Epic cotton jeans from Alpkit. I wouldn't pick it as a fabric for water resistance as it seems to be demanding in terms of care / washing and whatever gives it magicall properties soon weats off / gets overcome in normal use. Not much use for a backwaters trip I suspect.

Sorry, helping to rule out stuff rather than ingenious suggestions.

You have back, sack and cracked, of course?

CM, useful, ta.

I've a couple of pairs of Epic cotton jeans from Alpkit.

I have some of those, not bad at what they are but ruled out for distance riding shorts (or I would've cut-off the ones I tore crashing a few years back!)
And hair removal, what do you think I am, a roadie? : )

If you're going to plod (no offence) across great distances in vaguely inhospitable / rural conditions I can see that a bit of strategic depilation might be a good idea. Friction, cleanliness, creating an environment less hospitable to beasties etc

I liked my Epic jeans and when they discontinued them I bought a second pair. I think they suffered from poor batch control as they feel like a pair of my sister's (to use a common phrase).

They revised the fit at one point, i have a pair of each. I wear the baggy ones.. madchester over hipster here :)

By the power of bing image search I give you -

http://www.ardmoor.co.uk/products/11%20 ... rek-shorts
http://www.ski-outdoor-shop.de/produkte ... shorts-mud

I'm sure I read Patagonia used to do something similar.

If you don't include 'outdoor' in your search you get some tasty items like these back -
http://www.lyst.com/clothing/julius-bla ... im-shorts/

They are 3/4 length, but you've got to have some balls to pull them off ;-)

I'm like the look of the ones in the first link ... little costly at £100 mind.

thanks Paul, those Malojas look good. May able to get hold of them too. The last ones.. well, they're unique.. ) shown next to these at only £370 http://www.luisaviaroma.com/index.aspx# ... gn=Lyst-US and people say baggies should never be worn over tights.

anyone mentioned Cactus clothing yet?

some fella cycled 18000 k in a pair!
not so light weight but i don't think you would ever wear through them

http://www.cactusequipment.co.nz/online ... -shorts/95

http://www.cactusequipment.co.nz/online ... -shorts/95

Cactus shorts do look tough enough to do a RTW. I like their tip about external pockets and crouching down with a pocket full of nails.. designed from hard-earned experience perhaps!

jameso wrote:thanks Paul, those Malojas look good. May able to get hold of them too. The last ones.. well, they're unique.. ) shown next to these at only £370 http://www.luisaviaroma.com/index.aspx# ... gn=Lyst-US and people say baggies should never be worn over tights.

its the jacket, and the blokes face wearing that does it for me....
http://www.luisaviaroma.com/index.aspx# ... text=false

I have the howies Epic Cotton trousers and the shorts. While not waterproof (and they were only sold as water repellant anyway) they are great in light showers and dry very fast from a soaking. They are cut for cycling, no big seams on the ass and no rear pockets (redundant and more seams where you don't want it!)

A different material from the Alpkit Jeanius, my skinny Mk1's are about dead after 6 years and while they don't bead any more they dry about 3 days faster than regular denim!

SSP