Well spoken Dave Barter - agree with you on all counts.

Kev - sorry to see you scratch, but don't worry about not racing, ride your bike enjoy it. That's what matters.

Chew - stay safe on the way home. Give a shout when you're back and we'll grab a beer and some time on dirty bikes.

Just read Dave's post again and ...

I agree with the sentiment 100% but is it wrong to be a little pro-active with regard to personal safety when riding on the road? You know - lights, some reflective tape and maybe not dressing like the Milk Tray man at night. I'm fairly sure the view from the moral highground doesn't look half as good when viewed from a bed in ward B2.

Don't know - just typing out loud.

Bearbonesnorm wrote:I have to say Kevin and I hope I'm not speaking out of turn but I think you're being very hard on yourself. 'Bikepacking races' are about so much more than simply who's at the front. Don't be too hasty and never say never because missed opportunity lies down that road.

This times one thousand.

Bearbonesnorm wrote:Just read Dave's post again and ...

I agree with the sentiment 100% but is it wrong to be a little pro-active with regard to personal safety when riding on the road? You know - lights, some reflective tape and maybe not dressing like the Milk Tray man at night. I'm fairly sure the view from the moral highground doesn't look half as good when viewed from a bed in ward B2.

Don't know - just typing out loud.

No it is not wrong at all. I of course carry lights and reflective gear, my point is I am forced to by behaviour of others and shouldn't have to.

Bearbonesnorm wrote:I have to say Kevin and I hope I'm not speaking out of turn but I think you're being very hard on yourself. 'Bikepacking races' are about so much more than simply who's at the front. Don't be too hasty and never say never because missed opportunity lies down that road.

I've never raced others on any of these events. I'm competing with me, the only person that matters.

I genuinely wouldn't mind coming last as long as it meant finishing and knowing that I had toughed it out to get to the finish, where I might have otherwise quit.

(I've quit on occasions too... we're only human!)

Chew wrote:

mountainbaker wrote: He seems to find everything boring.

Good to know it's one friendly family, after we lost Frank earlier in the week....

I didn't mention Frank, and my comment had nothing to do with Frank. It was an observation of your consistently finding stuff to be boring/dull which often makes me wonder why you undertake these things..?

Anyway, sorry that you felt the need to scratch, never an easy thing to do, pretty soul destroying actually. Enjoy the tour back.

The reasons I will not race again are that I just don't want to be that guy at the back all the time even if I have tried my best. It is really dispiriting watching people just ride away from you all the time.

In NZ I stopped less than others or cycled longer so I would be regularly passed by the same people a couple of times a day. While nice to see peeps being constantly left behind does get wearing.

I will do routes, possibly race routes, but with the knowledge I can take short cuts or avoid bad weather.

Blackhound wrote:In NZ I stopped less than others or cycled longer so I would be regularly passed by the same people a couple of times a day. While nice to see peeps being constantly left behind does get wearing.

That's my bikepacking life. I was 'joking' in Tuscany that, whilst the event only had 600 people participating, I'd easily been passed 2-3000 times!!!

Come ride in Tuscany with me next year. It's a slow mosey of an event consisting of great food, fine wines and stunning scenery.

Is the tracking not working or just me? So out of touch with today's events!

Freeroute works: https://www.frrt.org/tcrno5/

Gairy, thanks for offer. At the moment the plan is to head to Scandinavia for a couple of months next summer in the 'van. I might undertake a tour before I go and later (September) but the TT maybe wrong timing for me with an early June departure date from UK.

I can see Trackleaders ok, Bjorn and James not far from CP3 and only 6km in it despite diferent routes. 1,000km spring for the line to look forward to.

Chew and I had a very similar route to Bjorn's but I noticed that James stayed South through Slovenia. I had looked at heading to Maribor and then North myself in the early days of planning but although flatter it was a lot further and unsure it was worth doing. Fascinating looking at some of the routes people have taken. Our initial route took us up to 2,500m into Italy but going via Innsbrook was 6km further and the Brenner Pass was only 1,300m elevation and yet some have taken the high road. Good on them but not for me.

I am enjoying Liam Glen's approach, seems he's decided to go passhunting and looks like he's enjoying himself https://www.instagram.com/liamtglen/

Dave makes good points but I probably agree more with Stu and even Ton, a bit ( ). In an argument with a car (or any other fast, hard lump) a rider loses almost every single time. Not taking that fact on board seems a wee bit daft. How much it's taken on board is a personal thing, life is not black and white (unless you live in STW world ) and most day-to-day stuff involves some degree of compromise.

Shame to hear someone was killed. Another bit of tragedy and sorrow in a world where there's probably more than enough

Sorry to hear folks scratched. In the light of everything else though I hope any such decision will soon fall into the realms of WGAS for you. Rocking up to the start line is more than 99% of the population

just been reading on stw, there have been a few car/rider interaction apparently.
hopefully nobody is seriously injured. just cements my opinion that riding to exhaustion on open roads is idiot. imho anyway.

ton wrote:just been reading on stw, there have been a few car/rider interaction apparently.
hopefully nobody is seriously injured. just cements my opinion that riding to exhaustion on open roads is idiot. imho anyway.

The facebook feeds from the riders aren't suggesting the riders were exhausted, did you make that part up? In fact, the feeds are very coherent, again, no suggestion on the writers/riders being exhausted at the time

I do hope the riders stay safe, good luck to those still on the road and healing vibes to those who aren't

Edit; in my life time, I've been hit three times by car drivers, one serious. All three times I wasn't exhausted

did you make that part up?

and exactly where did I write, that the riders were exhausted.

if you could read, instead of looking for a argument, I said ' cements MY OPINION '

read before spouting you fool.

Easy there you big beasts of the internet. Have a panda:

I've a trackleaders question, what does a red section of road mean? I'm guessing it's a section which must be ridden as there's one leading up to CP3?

Ton, "riding to exhaustion" would suggest that you think the riders are exhausted would it not?

If not, why ever mention exhaustion in your post?

Can we stop with the bickering

An eventful 24 hours trying to get home, and still a fair way to go.

I'll post something more coherent later once I'm not wearing the same clothes have had on for a week, and have had 8 showers and 5 baths.

Can we stop with the bickering

Hopefully ... however, I'm about to say something that might start it off again. I also realise some people really won't like me saying this - not that it usually stops me but apologies if it causes offence in any way.

Here goes ... if things are as bad out there as some report, then, is the TCR really a fitting legacy given the circumstances of Mike's death? I'm all for personal freedom and liberty but ...

if things are as bad out there as some report

Is this is a certain area of Europe? Only ask as I don't follow this on FB.

I'm not sure how i feel about the event in general, apart from thinking that the fastest way across Europe won't use the nicest, quietest roads or spend much time high up so it's not my thing. Having said that I think A-road TTers are, with respect, utterly barking mad : ) yet they seem to love it, it's just individual opinion. Plenty of smart, experienced people have ridden the TCR a few times though and driving habits don't change in a year or two.

I'm not sure how i feel about the event in general, apart from thinking that the fastest way across Europe won't use the nicest, quietest roads or spend much time high up so it's not my thing. Having said that I think A-road TTers are, with respect, utterly barking mad : ) yet they seem to love it, it's just individual opinion. Plenty of smart, experienced people have ridden the TCR a few times though and driving habits don't change in a year or two so.

All very true James. I just can't help thinking there's a certain level of cruel and I'm sure, unwanted irony about it all.

Bearbonesnorm wrote:

Can we stop with the bickering

Hopefully ... however, I'm about to say something that might start it off again. I also realise some people really won't like me saying this - not that it usually stops me but apologies if it causes offence in any way.

Here goes ... if things are as bad out there as some report, then, is the TCR really a fitting legacy given the circumstances of Mike's death? I'm all for personal freedom and liberty but ...

Yes, quite simply because he was integral to its conception it and I've been following many riders who appear to be loving it.

if things are as bad out there as some report

I assume that it's a statistical anomaly. Other than the whole fatigue thing I can't see any reasons TCR riders are more at risk than other riders and it's not like there's been a high number of accidents since the events inception.

jameso wrote:I'm not sure how i feel about the event in general, apart from thinking that the fastest way across Europe won't use the nicest, quietest roads or spend much time high up so it's not my thing. Having said that I think A-road TTers are, with respect, utterly barking mad : ) yet they seem to love it, it's just individual opinion. Plenty of smart, experienced people have ridden the TCR a few times though and driving habits don't change in a year or two.

+1