Richard G wrote:Thanks all. This is all very new to me, so I'm learning a lot.

For me, fitness is easy to work on, but specifics like this are nigh on impossible to get without talking to people with experience. :)

I'm in the same bag as you, reading all these "racing" experts

I would add that having a system you repeat every day (and resist mucking with on the trip) helps non racers even as you reduce the faff of working out what could go where and how it might feel on the bike (then stopping, and repacking everything how it was first any-sodding-way! )

As said before - oversized bags so you can cram things in.

Nice and tight kit bags look great in the kitchen or garden - but are a bugger when you're out, wet, cold, and trying to cram an extra burrito in.

So I'm thinking that it's probably much quicker to chuck all your stuff into one drybag rather than mess around getting it into individual stuff sacks... but is it actually harder to get it all to fit that way?

All of my sleeping stuff lives in my front roll (sleeping bag, pillow, fresh socks, leggings, jacket etc), and I'm guessing I might be best off getting it vaguely rolled up and thrown in together rather than worrying about having it all perfectly compressed?

my medium sweet roll pissed me off last week when i rolled up my summer bag and bivvy together then tried to slip it into the sweetroll....

no dice. worked real well in my garden and even decanted lovely at our bivy arrival.

took some swearing to go back in .compared to my 13litre airlok id been using previous.


Revised plan for this weekend - i still want the sweet roll to work as its just about the only thing that clears my front tyre on my favorite bike.

GregMay wrote:As said before - oversized bags so you can cram things in.

Nice and tight kit bags look great in the kitchen or garden - but are a bugger when you're out, wet, cold, and trying to cram an extra burrito in.

One problem I had with that on last year's YD300 was that on the second morning the dry bag in my saddle harness was not full enough due to wearing more clothes because of the weather and it dragged on the rear wheel - of course this didn't happen straight away but about ten minutes later in the middle of a long fast descent. It was my first ITT and of course you live and learn. Having something like a duvet or whatever that can expand and take up the slack can help.

Edit: Meant to say that we all make different mistakes and what can seem obvious to one person isn't to another, sometimes just by happy accident we get things right without knowing.

So I'm thinking that it's probably much quicker to chuck all your stuff into one drybag rather than mess around getting it into individual stuff sacks... but is it actually harder to get it all to fit that way?

I shan't say this again - stuff sacks are Satan's semen, they cause dead space, make packing awkward and can lead to floppy bags

With regard to your sleeping gear, use a dry bag that's large enough to fit it all in. Place the item you want last in first and so forth and so on. Compress the whole lot in there together and leave well alone until called upon.

I'm going to use some mesh bags to keep clean/dirty/sleep/thermal kit separated in a dry bag, reasoning that the mesh takes up no space and still let's me squish all the air out. I'm also planning to use them should I get the chance to wash my kit to save the straps getting ripped off my bibs shorts!

In my case, it wasn't internal dry bags or stuff in its stuff sack, there just wasn't enough stuff in there to be able to tighten things up.

Bearbonesnorm wrote:I shan't say this again - stuff sacks are Satan's semen, they cause dead space, make packing awkward and can lead to floppy bags

I bet you will. :D

On the subject of changing... assuming it's not raining, is it better to change into your sleeping gear fairly quickly (whilst you're warm)?

On the subject of changing... assuming it's not raining, is it better to change into your sleeping gear fairly quickly (whilst you're warm)?

As long as you're not sweating (as mentioned earlier by Greg) and it won't get wet (as mentioned just now by you).

Richard G wrote:

Bearbonesnorm wrote:I shan't say this again - stuff sacks are Satan's semen, they cause dead space, make packing awkward and can lead to floppy bags

I bet you will. :D

On the subject of changing... assuming it's not raining, is it better to change into your sleeping gear fairly quickly (whilst you're warm)?

I do but it's mainly to get out of any sweaty clothing since I cool down quickly as mentioned in an early response. Strip off (ooh-err!), dry down, dry clothes on. A small micro-fibre towel is worth carrying for this.

In my case, it wasn't internal dry bags or stuff in its stuff sack, there just wasn't enough stuff in there to be able to tighten things up.

After playing round with a 'new to the bikepacking market' brand of saddle bag and previous experience of the large Apidura saddle bag, I do wonder whether this will become a bigger problem than it has been previously ... bags seem to be growing and it's not something I see as a positive move. Not only will it encourage you to carry more crap, it might demand it.

Bearbonesnorm wrote:

In my case, it wasn't internal dry bags or stuff in its stuff sack, there just wasn't enough stuff in there to be able to tighten things up.

After playing round with a 'new to the bikepacking market' brand of saddle bag and previous experience of the large Apidura saddle bag, I do wonder whether this will become a bigger problem than it has been previously ... bags seem to be growing and it's not something I see as a positive move. Not only will it encourage you to carry more crap, it might demand it.

Last year's YD300 was a ride of two halves - Saturday was bright, sunny and warm whereas Sunday was dull, cool and wet (at least until about lunch time) so you went from short sleeved top to everything. Perhaps a case of having to deal with two extremes which might not normally be the case as you'd swap two similar sets of clothing not a summer set for a winter one.

Had a similar problem on the JennRide in that I packed my Exped dry bag on the front a bit oddly and on the last descent it flew out of the harness The Alpkit Airlok has loops to fit straps through so even though it's heavier, it's actually a better thing to use since I can thread the harness straps through it and it isn't going anywhere.

I quite like the apidura for that. It's heavier, but you know that you're definitely not losing the dry bag inside it.

I'm obviously far too casual. Set up time is quick - less than 10 mins if its raining or the midges are out. In the morning its a different story - wake up, lie awake for a bit, sit up and put the kettle on, dig out breakfast whilst its heating up, make a brew, drink and eat. Then make another brew and drink it. I'm fairly quick getting everything packed up - sleeping bag and liner plus any spare clothing and my pj's go into the terrapin dry bag and its only then that I will emerge into the world, all geared up if its raining and all smidged up if its not. Taking the tent down can be done in 5 mins plus another 5 minst to get everything on the bike. The above rarely takes less than an hour and I can string it out to 2 if I feel like it (add in reading a few chapters of my book). Not exactly racer but its all rest time so I don't stress - extra rest = more recovery and easier riding. Plus I'm on holiday after all!

That's true but if you re like me and not so good at getting up in the morning, that sort of non-plan means you don't leave till midday

Whoa, there's a hell of a lot of analysis on here.....

Which is a good thing. It allows people to progress themselves.

Totally agree, but it is easy to get caught up in the little things instead of just getting out there and doing it.

It's an internet discussion so we are supposed to go in to the minutiae so you don't have to

Some simple figures in a completely unrealistic scenario:

Mr H. Efficiency practices Greg's streamlined bivy procedure and sleeps for five hours each day and has one hour of stops through the rest of the day leaving 18hrs riding time.

Major Faff also sleeps for five hours and has one hour of stops but these are surrounded by half an hour before and after of "sorting things out" meaning he has 16hrs riding time per day.

If Mr Efficiency averages 8kph for those 18hrs then Mjr Faff needs to average 9kph just to keep up which doesn't sound like much but it's a 12.5% increase in speed.

how ever the time spent on here discussing details is not time that could possibly be spent out there doing it......
i rode in this morning all packed and ready to go for tonight although i had to have a change of packing strategy in whole - drop bars and sweet roll dont mix. So its carradice camper long flap this week.

Trail-rat wrote:how ever the time spent on here discussing details is not time that could possibly be spent out there doing it......

True, but having time while waiting for a bug that your boss can see but you can't to manifest itself leaves the brain free for musing

im manning technical support today.

We have no current on going operations.

Its going to be a long day.

whitestone wrote:If Mr Efficiency averages 8kph for those 18hrs then Mjr Faff needs to average 9kph just to keep up which doesn't sound like much but it's a 12.5% increase in speed.

Nice.

For me, it's about balancing both really. I can still get a little faster, but my biggest weakness is definitely in the camping aspect of it... even down to the sleeping (funnily enough, I'm actually training myself to sleep on my back).

If you're not racing then it's all a bit moot really but it could make the difference between having coffee and cake at the station and rushing to get the last train