Bearbonesnorm wrote:I really hope that no governing body ever decides to take a closer look at bikepacking ... the very fact that no one's interested, is one of the things that makes it great and long may it continue.

Its coming. Mark my words.

There are plenty of small companies, one man bands etc. in this country that are starting to offer bikepacking as a paid trip / experience etc.
In the good ol' U S of A, salsa are hosting events on how to do it.

1 accident, 1 public incident, 1 something.....

The law will be on us. defining what, when and how we are allowed to do.

Dave earlier today

A yes and no response to that FLV.

Once "commercial interests" take something then that side gets regulated, usually self regulated - to "show responsibility" though it's often the equivalent of putting Dracula in charge of a blood bank. Personal activities tend not to come under those remits. Climbing is a case in point: there are lots of commercial concerns from individuals through to what are effectively companies like the Alpine bureaux des guides but individuals are still able to head out and do their thing. Fell running perhaps is more similar to bikepacking in that it's a small niche within running (and coming under similar pressures from companies offering trail races which can cover a lot of similar ground with some familiar arguments about their effect).

The biggest problem that I see isn't regulation on what we as individuals can do but the exposure of the fragile relationship between low key activities and land owners. I'm aware of not making it obvious that I'm bivvying for example: not flashing lights around and the like; even to the point of randomly unflattening the grass I've been lying on before leaving in the morning so that there's as few signs as possible that I've been there. The clients of commercial outfits seldom have such concerns, they've paid for the experience and anything else isn't their problem. Commercial trips often use the same locations for camps whereas individuals are more random and so spread the load. Landowners can, quite rightly, get upset if people are taking advantage of them without permission or even recompense - there was a case in the Dales of an old quarry being developed for climbing, the farmer was tolerant until a firm decided to use it to run courses without asking him. Due to this and problems with one or two visitors not being nice to his neighbours, he banned access.

Currently we are "flying under the radar" as it were, I'm sure quite a few landowners know that it goes on but since it's not causing them a problem they aren't too bothered.

I don't think there is any connection between governing bodies and draconian regulation. Loads of people die mountaineering, but there are few laws governing what privateer mountaineers do. Commercial ventures should, quite rightly, be regulated, to avoid cowboys outfits exposing clients to unnecessary dangers. For example, would parents would send their kids into the great outdoors with an unkown outfit (ski, climb, canoe, whatever) that didn't have qualified, insured instructors?

Organisations like the BMC do good work to promote the interests of walkers and climbers in the UK. If there is a threat (and I don't perceive one), it is when their is a conflict of interests between mountain bikers and walkers/horse riders, etc; the winner of that will be the side that is best organised and has the loudest voice in the corridors of power - NGBs are also lobby groups, and mountain bikers are probably the worst at getting organised and having their interests represented.

Bearbonesnorm wrote:Dave earlier today

Actually looks a bit like you without the beard...

Do I remember seeing a an MTB race advertised possibly in Italy that had an entry requirement that included licenses?
Apologies if not.

Actually looks a bit like you without the beard...

Now you mention it

http://bikepackersmagazine.com/train-bi ... ing-races/

Big difference between training for a race on a personal level and training towards a qualification that 'allows' you to take other people bikepacking.

If you can get to North Wales, there's this guy: http://www.carbon-monkey.co.uk/wp/index ... kepacking/

I'm really not sure what kind of value you'd get from this, and I'm normally one who enjoys training etc but in the case of bikepacking, I prefer the idea of just getting out there and seeing what happens. I think I'd learn more from "having a go" with other, more experienced riders than I might from something considered a formal training system. Plus I found the price tag a little over the top, but I'm a tight git, so there you go.

Regarding governing bodies and qualifications, I come from a SCUBA diving background and it's a complete minefield. The biggest concern that most people face is ensuring life insurance policies are still valid, and this is made worse by the insurance companies not understanding the sport itself.
Long may we remain under the radar and in the shadows...

I've taken people out on 'trips' before in a professional capacity, some people have just wanted to experience the joy and misery that bikepacking offers and others have wanted something more akin to 'skills training'. In reality either works well and allows people who perhaps don't have friends who are into bikepacking to gain some experience / guidance without jumping straight in the deep-end.

Sadly, the last two BB Summer Camps have both been cancelled due to lack of interest but at the AlpKit BSO last year the bikepacking workshops proved very popular, were well attended and enjoyed by all. I'm not sure whether that says anything other than those that are already involved feel proficient enough to just crack on?

Anyway, I'm rambling so please feel free to ignore the above

Bearbonesnorm wrote:I've taken people out on 'trips' before in a professional capacity, some people have just wanted to experience the joy and misery that bikepacking offers and others have wanted something more akin to 'skills training'. In reality either works well and allows people who perhaps don't have friends who are into bikepacking to gain some experience / guidance without jumping straight in the deep-end.

Sadly, the last two BB Summer Camps have both been cancelled due to lack of interest but at the AlpKit BSO last year the bikepacking workshops proved very popular, were well attended and enjoyed by all. I'm not sure whether that says anything other than those that are already involved feel proficient enough to just crack on?

Anyway, I'm rambling so please feel free to ignore the above

Out of curiosity Stu, what kind of specific skills are you asked to demonstrate or provide instruction on? Is it riding itself, or something more specific to bikepacking?

Out of curiosity Stu, what kind of specific skills are you asked to demonstrate or provide instruction on? Is it riding itself, or something more specific to bikepacking?

Bikepacking skills, such as erecting a tarp, selecting a suitable over-night spot, how to find clean water, route planning (yeah, I know) .... riding skills are a different thing and fall under the Forest Freeride banner.