Condoms, .

johnnystorm wrote:But you've proved my point by having a downmat for comfort!

For the saying to be wrong you'd have to have two things of identical performance of which one was substantially cheaper than the other.

But they have different purposes? The downmat is for "camping" where i just wanna be comfy or winter trips for warmth, the foam mat is for light weight trips where it won't be too cold.

Ben98 wrote:

johnnystorm wrote:But you've proved my point by having a downmat for comfort!

For the saying to be wrong you'd have to have two things of identical performance of which one was substantially cheaper than the other.

But they have different purposes? The downmat is for "camping" where i just wanna be comfy or winter trips for warmth, the foam mat is for light weight trips where it won't be too cold.

What's the performance of your down mat like? I mean does it work well on cold ground? And how comfortable is it? Surely when you lie on it it compresses down to nothing? Or am I missing the point.

Ta

C.

Using that argument Keith can never be right as you'll just say your noodly, easily snapped frame and forks, etc is just for going to the shops on.

What's the performance of your down mat like? I mean does it work well on cold ground? And how comfortable is it? Surely when you lie on it it compresses down to nothing? Or am I missing the point.

They're an air mat with down inside so they don't compress (much) when you lie on them.

Ben98 wrote: the foam mat is for light weight trips where it won't be too cold.

So Ben, what is this foam mat and what are the dimensions - homemade goodness?

I think KB was generally right, but every time we buy a component we try to get the sweet spot of light enough, strong enough (for the task), and affordable enough - all subjective, of course. Some brands look much better value on weight Vs Cost, but the strength/durability factor is often only discovered when something fails! Thankfully forums like this can let us learn from others misjudgements as well as our own...

ZeroDarkBivi wrote:

Ben98 wrote: the foam mat is for light weight trips where it won't be too cold.

So Ben, what is this foam mat and what are the dimensions - homemade goodness?

It's the cheapest foil backed foam mat off eBay, cut it in half then trimmed down to rougly body shaped. I then spent 2 *uckin* hours punching inch diameter holes in it in nice regular lines as I wondered how much weight it would save, turns out *uck all! A grand sum of 5g! But on the plus side it does roll up much smaller with the holes (I still have an identical one without holes as a control).

I'm not sure if this has been mentioned, but I think "Strong, Light Cheap" isn't really the correct criterion to judge something, I'd have said "Effective, Light, Cheap" would make more sense when looking for a bargain of sorts. Just my £0.02

Ben98 wrote:I then spent 2 *uckin* hours punching inch diameter holes in it in nice regular lines as I wondered how much weight it would save, turns out *uck all!

I'm sure you could have saved some time to work that out using a calculator ;-)

Zippy wrote:

Ben98 wrote:I then spent 2 *uckin* hours punching inch diameter holes in it in nice regular lines as I wondered how much weight it would save, turns out *uck all!

I'm sure you could have saved some time to work that out using a calculator ;-)

I was gonna try, but after weighing 1 cutout disc on the scales and it coming up at 0g, my calculation would have come to 0g even with infinite holes punched

But you knew the total weight of the mat and its surface area. Also known is the surface area of each circle and the number of intended holes which would tell you the weight saving...

Another way to look at it.

If each disk weights 0grams its entirely logical to conclude the matt is infact in possession of zero mass.

Quick put the disks back you've taken some of the lightweightness out and made it heavier.

Joshvegas wrote:Another way to look at it.

If each disk weights 0grams its entirely logical to conclude the matt is infact in possession of zero mass.

Quick put the disks back you've taken some of the lightweightness out and made it heavier.

I've just had a couple of beers, this makes logical sense to me

Any chance of a picture of the mat with holes?

ianfitz wrote:But you knew the total weight of the mat and its surface area. Also known is the surface area of each circle and the number of intended holes which would tell you the weight saving...

Beat me to it.

But you meant volume, not surface area, although if the same thickness, then you're ok

Pirahna wrote:Any chance of a picture of the mat with holes?

Will sort one out asap, but might be a couple of days.

Zippy wrote:

ianfitz wrote:But you knew the total weight of the mat and its surface area. Also known is the surface area of each circle and the number of intended holes which would tell you the weight saving...

Beat me to it.

But you meant volume, not surface area, although if the same thickness, then you're ok

I've seen the mat and my craftmans eye reckoned it to be universal thickness, hence surface area for the calculation as it's one less factor

If you've kept the holes and there's enough of them you could just place them down in a rectangular formation and sleep on that?