Tents.

MussEd · Post by **MussEd** » Fri Apr 17, 2015 2:33 pm

Ok, I'm new to this and exploring shelter options. I'm well aware that of massive range of prices for bike gear but can someone explain a few things specific to bikepacking?

This tent is £30 http://m.gooutdoors.co.uk/hi-gear-soloista-p217173

The Wild Country by Terra Nova with which looks as if it shares a few design features is about £120 - and only weighs slightly less.

Then there are loads of spendy spendy items which again look very similar. £400 plus doesn't seem to even reach the upper echelons of tent-spend...

I've been a firm believer of "you get what you pay for" for a while but is this £30 tent really going to perform that much worse than it's much much more expensive brethren?

I probably know (some of)the answer - better longevity, quality of materials used original R&D, smaller batch numbers, handmade etc etc, but it's going to be a while and a few trips before I can work up the grit to push the button on one of the £££ items!

touch · Post by **touch** » Fri Apr 17, 2015 2:54 pm

You need to look at the HH value (Hydrostatic Head - or "waterproofness") as well as weight.

Hi Gear Soloista
Flysheet HH: 1500mm
Groundsheet HH: 3000mm

Wild Country Zephyros 1 (which I think is the tent you're referring to)
Flysheet HH: 4000mm
Groundsheet: 6000mm

danielgroves · Post by **danielgroves** » Fri Apr 17, 2015 6:42 pm

It's well worth spending the extra on a good tent. I've been using Wild Country and Terra Nova tents for about 10 years now, and love them all. I've never doubted that every penny is money well spent.

Not only are you getting the better hydrostatic head, as pointed out by touch, but you're going to get a better tent made from stronger materials, with better design features and and smaller packing unit. You're probably going to find that a better designed tent is faster to pitch too. I can get my Terra Nova Laser (the tent the previously mentioned Wild Country Zephyros was based off) up in a couple of minutes.

Also, it's worth noting that the Hi Gear tent you linked is an inner-first pitch. If it's bucketing it down, you're going to get wetter while pitching it and the inside will be wetter by the time you got the inner up, and attached the fly sheet.

Bearbonesnorm · Post by **Bearbonesnorm** » Fri Apr 17, 2015 6:56 pm

Sadly it's not all about weight. That cheaper tent has 63cm headroom which pretty much makes it a coffin. It also has fibreglass poles which can be brittle and easily broken. It pitches inner first which can be a real pain in the rain and means no option for a fly only pitch ... it may only be thirty quid but it's thirty quid you'll have to spend a second time.

The Zephyros is a good choice and can be had fairly cheaply with some careful shopping. Vango are also worth a look, their Helix 100 looks pretty good, alloy poles, 90cm headroom, 1.5kg but again it's inner pitch first.

http://www.outdooraction.co.uk/tents-1- ... oC9P_w_wcB

johnnystorm · Post by **johnnystorm** » Fri Apr 17, 2015 7:34 pm

A colleague has that Hi Gear tent bit with a different label, it's like a reverse Tardis. I paid about £300 for my Terra Nova Quasar but it was worth it. That was in 1997.

MussEd · Post by **MussEd** » Fri Apr 17, 2015 7:38 pm

I know what you mean about coffin - I actually had a try of the Soloista and it would be a case of lying down at all times.

Ok next question - I've seen the Terra Nova Laser mentioned before in favourable terms. If this is based on the Zephyros where would the extra money go if I were to opt for the Laser? I'm not being awkward or argumentative here, which is unusual for me, just looking for the benefit of wisdom of folk who know their stuff!

danielgroves · Post by **danielgroves** » Fri Apr 17, 2015 7:56 pm

Ok next question - I've seen the Terra Nova Laser mentioned before in favourable terms. If this is based on the Zephyros where would the extra money go if I were to opt for the Laser? I'm not being awkward or argumentative here, which is unusual for me, just looking for the benefit of wisdom of folk who know their stuff!

Well, I'm a laser user so I'll try and answer this as best I can. I'm using the Competition 1 (the cheaper one) for comparison.

The laser uses a thinner and lighter type of nylon. It's a silicon coated material, which means that some pin-prick type holes can easy by sorted. The fibres sort of slide back into place when you rub them. I remember when I was showed this by Terra Nova at the outdoor show years ago… was a bit weird.

Weight, you're loosing about 600g with the laser. That's pretty significant.

Fastpack compatible… you can leave the inner behind and pitch it without an inner in at all to further cut the weight down

DAC poles. Lighter, stronger, stiffer.

Ventilation system. With the laser you can open the ends of the tent using pull-lines (so you don't even have to leave your sleeping bag!) which allows you to adjust the ventilation to help shift any condensation build up.

Laser packs smaller.

Laser is a tad taller and a tad wider, so you've got more space inside.

danielgroves · Post by **danielgroves** » Fri Apr 17, 2015 7:58 pm

Worth noting the hydrostatic head is a tad lower on the laser (I'm actually surprised by this!).

Also, lifetime guarantee vs. 2 year.

MussEd · Post by **MussEd** » Fri Apr 17, 2015 9:31 pm

Thanks for that, laid out like that explains the difference much more clearly than just figures on spec sheets for the respective tents...still not sure I can spring for the Laser though...

johnnystorm · Post by **johnnystorm** » Fri Apr 17, 2015 9:56 pm

Does linking to this make matters more confusing...

http://bearbonesbikepacking.blogspot.co ... t.html?m=1

TheBrownDog · Post by **TheBrownDog** » Sat Apr 18, 2015 6:40 am

Does linking to this make matters more confusing...

If it does, this will drive you nuts. Some brilliant looking tarptents here. Im looking at the MLD Supermid and wondering how much damage spending £250 on 850g of silnylon will do to my marriage.

http://www.outdoorgearlab.com/Ultraligh ... ws/ratings

rudedog · Post by **rudedog** » Sat Apr 18, 2015 9:40 am

It depends on your intended use - You don't need to spend silly money on a shelter to get something decent if it's use will be general bike packing duties. The wild Country zephyros can be got for £100 (it was down to £75 the other weekend)

Much of the expensive stuff is designed for adventure racing where going ultralight will make a difference. Of course everyone will like to carry less and it's a personal choice for most on cost vs weight.

Bearbonesnorm · Post by **Bearbonesnorm** » Sat Apr 18, 2015 5:58 pm

Vango Zenith might just be worth a look.

http://www.outbacktrading.co.uk/product ... -100-tent/

MussEd · Post by **MussEd** » Thu Apr 23, 2015 1:27 pm

Well. Been a away looking at various options thrown up by this thread (and others). Still no further forward! My mind is now abuzz with all the different possibilities, very nearly pushed the button on the zephyros, then that Vango Zenith......however doubts about inner first pitching stopped me. I've kind of resigned myself to spending more now. Not sure why!

Now thinking a tarp tent might be the way forward. I love the simplicity, versatility and low weight a Tarp set up can bring but not sure I'd cope with the inevitable midge-geddon a nice night in the highlands would bring.

If this is primarily to be used in Scotland, would you guys recommend tarptent like Trekkertent (stealth I think - and there seems to be an issue with completing orders ATM) or Smd skyscape/lunar over a tarp and bivvy bag, given the likelihood of winged teeth?

Bearbonesnorm · Post by **Bearbonesnorm** » Thu Apr 23, 2015 1:59 pm

Trekkertent (stealth I think - and there seems to be an issue with completing orders ATM)

I know Marcs very bust at present and also trying to get his new workshop set up.

If you want simplicity then a Lunar Solo takes some beating. The SkyScape also looks good, I know Gairy has one and really likes it.

I'd also consider having a look at the Luxe Mini Peak II and at the moment £100 will buy you a Silshelter and inner from Needlesports.

All the above will keep the midges out, the choice really comes down to whether you want a true 'tarp-tent' or something with a removable inner?

fatbikephil · Post by **fatbikephil** » Thu Apr 23, 2015 6:15 pm

+1 for vangos - good value and good deals always available. Standard Helium 100 is a good start as its just over a kilo and my mate has used one in all weathers.

rudedog · Post by **rudedog** » Thu Apr 23, 2015 8:17 pm

MussEd wrote: very nearly pushed the button on the zephyros, then that Vango Zenith......however doubts about inner first pitching stopped me. I've kind of resigned myself to spending more now. Not sure why!

I'm not sure I follow you here - both those tents can be pitched with inner and outer together or outer first. I'm sure they can be pitched as outer ony if you wanted to save some weight and go for the tarp tent experience :)

MussEd · Post by **MussEd** » Thu Apr 23, 2015 9:22 pm

Satanorm - I'd looked at Needlesports earlier and the bug liner has sold out....

And Rudedog - sure someone earlier in the thread said those two were inner first, and both together only? Maybe I'm misreading things, to be honest between trying to decide on the tent quandary and looking at sleeping mats andquilts my head is minced!

Bearbonesnorm · Post by **Bearbonesnorm** » Thu Apr 23, 2015 9:38 pm

And Rudedog - sure someone earlier in the thread said those two were inner first, and both together only? Maybe I'm misreading things, to be honest between trying to decide on the tent quandary and looking at sleeping mats andquilts my head is minced!

The Zephyros and Zenith can be pitched either inner / outer as one or as outer only ... inner just unclips. I've always thought it's the best way of doing things for a UK tent.

rudedog · Post by **rudedog** » Thu Apr 23, 2015 9:57 pm

MussEd wrote:Satanorm - I'd looked at Needlesports earlier and the bug liner has sold out....

And Rudedog - sure someone earlier in the thread said those two were inner first, and both together only? Maybe I'm misreading things, to be honest between trying to decide on the tent quandary and looking at sleeping mats andquilts my head is minced!

Your'e getting mixed up - it was the original hi gear tent you posted which was inner first pitch.

MussEd · Post by **MussEd** » Thu Apr 23, 2015 10:10 pm

Ah well! That's that then...almost back to the original choices and more £££ for mats and quilts and stoves and God knows what other bits of stuff I'll probably start obsessing about!

rudedog · Post by **rudedog** » Thu Apr 23, 2015 10:36 pm

If you're looking for a good mat, I really can't recommend the exped synmat ul7 enough - its extremely comfy, insulated enough for winter camping and is lightweight at around 450g and you can be got for around £70. I think this has been my best bike packing purchase I've made and has really made a difference to the quality of sleep I get in a tent.

MussEd · Post by **MussEd** » Thu Apr 23, 2015 10:55 pm

Thanks for that. Saw that one mentioned elsewhere so it's good to hear another favourable mention...

Matt · Post by **Matt** » Fri Apr 24, 2015 8:31 am

I would suggest it's worth looking at a Hunka XL & a bicycle 3.5

Not an expensive mistake to make and will always find a home on here if you don't get on with a bag and tarp.

Done me for 5 years

( I do fancy a Trecker tent now though )

MussEd · Post by **MussEd** » Fri Apr 24, 2015 1:29 pm

I do fancy tarp and bag set up for minimalism but the midge fear is strong! not sure I'd be able cope TBH...

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